This is an adapted excerpt from the Dec. 9 episode of "The Beat with Ari Melber."
President-elect Donald Trump is now showing that some of his most extreme rhetoric during the campaign will guide how he governors. In an interview with NBC News’ Kristen Welker, his first broadcast sit-down since the election, Trump is taking sides against police and for violent convicts.
We have a former U.S. president, who will soon find himself back in the White House, embracing criminals who attempted to overthrow the government.
Trump told Welker he would likely pardon those convicted of violence on Jan. 6, even convicts who savagely attacked police that day. When Welker pressed Trump on whether he would pardon the 169 people who have pleaded guilty to assaulting police officers, Trump responded that those individuals “had no choice.”Trump promised he would act on these pardons on the very first day of his term. A blanket pardon from the White House could even include the leaders of the insurrection, who were convicted of the gravest felonies including sedition.
This is serious. We have a former U.S. president, who will soon find himself back in the White House, embracing criminals who attempted to overthrow the government, some of whom were charged with violently attacking Capitol Police and conspiring against the government. Many of those people also advocated for the assassination of members of the U.S. government.
In the immediate aftermath of that attack on the Capitol, there wasn’t a partisan divide between Republicans and Democrats in Washington on this issue. Instead, there was a divide between Trump’s insurrection supporters and everyone else.
You may recall some Republicans, who fled for their lives from Trump supporters, returning to the Senate floor — then a crime scene — without time to consult polls or sample their state parties. These senators took to the floor to declare that the violence of those Trump supporters was wrong and beyond the pale.
“We will not be kept out of this chamber by thugs, mobs or threats,” Sen. Mitch McConnell said. “This failed insurrection only underscores how crucial the task before us is.”Sen. Rand Paul called the violence of that day “un-American.” Sen. Marco Rubio, now Trump’s pick for secretary of state, told his colleagues “There’s nothing Vladimir Putin could’ve come up with better than what happened here, [it] makes us look like we’re in total chaos and collapse.”
“Violence is not how you achieve change,” Sen. Josh Hawley said at the time. While Sen. Lindsey Graham declared, “Enough is enough.”
Well, enough was enough — until it wasn’t. Rubio could soon join an administration that’s pledging to pardon the same individuals he and his colleagues railed against on that day.
More than one thousand Americans have since been convicted for crimes related to the events of Jan. 6. That includes some participants who assaulted police officers. One man was sentenced to 20 years in prison after he used bear spray directly inside the mask of one officer. That officer testified that he thought he might die. The same individual used a crutch to smash another officer’s head, giving him a concussion.
One of the Proud Boys members who stormed the Capitol told the judge who sentenced him to six years in prison, “You could give me 100 years and I would still do it all over again.” There’s also Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes, who prosecutors allege helped organize the insurrection. He was sentenced to 18 years for seditious conspiracy, a serious and rare crime. The judge told Stewart he “present[s] an ongoing threat and peril to this country.”
Some of these convicts are confident Trump will give them a get-out-of-jail-free card — and they’re not afraid to say so. One man told the judge at his sentencing, “Trump’s gonna pardon me anyways.”
Those are some of the most egregious examples, but there are hundreds more. The prospect of pardoning up to one thousand people for the crimes committed that day would be unprecedented.
One man told the judge at his sentencing, “Trump’s gonna pardon me anyways.”
We can look to history for some parallels, but even those are not apples to apples. Take the Civil War, which was a rebellion that ultimately resulted in mass pardons. Then-President Andrew Johnson issued an amnesty pardon in 1865 to most former Confederate officials and soldiers.Over the next few years, Johnson went on to issue 13,000 pardons for more Confederate soldiers, including those who were previously labeled traitors. His last one, on Dec. 25, 1868, was a full pardon and amnesty to all persons engaged in the late rebellion.
Johnson’s pardon of Confederate soldiers was highly controversial. A Politico report notes Johnson’s pardon policy was “one very large component of the policy decisions that led to his impeachment … It made him one of the most loathed presidents in American history.”
Now, no one is stating the Jan. 6 insurrection was anything like the Civil War. But the legal precedents are that far and few between because attacks on the United States and its governments are fairly rare. And it is extremely rare to see this kind of use, or abuse as some may call it, of the pardon power.
Trump is pushing out these plans now in an attempt to normalize this use of the pardon power before he takes office. But, as those Republican senators said in the immediate aftermath of that attack, there was nothing normal about what took place on Jan. 6.
Allison Detzel contributed.